Tumble turns
cheezypees
Posts: 13
in General Chat
My swimming is coming along slowly (from virtually nowhere when i started) to the point where i can swim 1500m crawl in the pool.
However i am still not tumble turning. I tried doing it last night at the end of my session and didn't make a very good job of it i.e. bad timing, positioning water going up my nose and surfacing way too early and losing speed.
This of course is a very long-winded way of asking if anyone has any tips on how to perform a good tumble turn?
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Here are some points i concentrate on:
I tend to wait until I'm roughly 1.5 arm's length away before turning
i make sure my head is tucked tightly into my chest before turning
i kick off the wall facing upwards before turning at my hip back onto my front to restart the crawl
All as fluently as i can.....not very!!!!!
I'm sure there are much more experienced guy on here from swimming backgrounds that could help more and I'll be watching this thread with interest.
I hope this help,
Lee
That said I must confess to learning to tumble turn but just to impress in the pool if i'm honest. I rearely ever use it. The main thing I found difficult was missing the big breath at the wall.
Having said that, feel free to try and learn them anyway if you want to. We learned them by breaking it down in pieces. For example, first practise the tumble part. Swim towards the wall and try to find the right distance to tumble by trial, so you dont hit the wall with your head or tumble too soon and look like a fish on land[:D]. Just practise the tumbling part first until you get it right. Work on the turning part once you get the first step right, before you can mash it together.
From then on it's just repeating and practising that makes it better and more natural.
It's harder on the breathing in the beginning, but practising will help this. Oh ye, blow air out of your nose when tumbling for the water entering problem.
Cheezypees simply wanted a rough guide on how to tumble turn not every reason why he doesn't need to know!!!
There are many pool based tri's around as we all know and tumble turning can in some cases take a second or more off your length time when executed well....so why not learn?!?
I believe you can never know too much and its always an advantage to have the option!
Personally, i only tumble turn in the pool if i have a pool based tri on the near horizon for which i need to practice, i otherwise touch turn. I'm not trying to show off, i simply want to maximise the turn in a pool race situation!
I'm sure most triathletes would rather know than not so given the option.
maybe some people dont wanna look like a circus act in a busy pool while learning to tumble turn? i consider more vein !!!
I say learn to tumble turn because you'll always have the option.
Lee
Well i never! Cheers for the advice everyone. I'm all confused now :-)
The reason i thought i should start doing tumble turns is because of the big breath you get at the end of a length (as TriHard mentioned) when you just touch turn. I figured it was cheating because i am giving myself a little rest each length.
Thanks for the tips Bristol Newbie, i'll have a go at those at the end of my session tonight.
I'm doing 2 pool based tri's next spring so tumble turns would be useful for that but i'll take the general consensus advice and mostly leave them for pool tri's and time trials, i'll stick to normal turns for general training.
If anyone had seen my first attempts at tumbling they would know that this is definitely not a vanity thing!!!
Watching other swimmers (if they execute it properly) makes the swim look so much sleeker, and encourages you to control your breathing more which is surely a benefit in pool or openwater swimming?
Cheesey peas...as benny says break it up a bit. start by doing lengths with a tumble every 3 or 4 strokes, no wall involved just get the tumble right, tuck your chin in and think of your head as a heavy weight, your body will follow. Then think about using the wall.
Would be good to know what other people think?
Thanks
Stephen
Good for training as tumbleturning mimics open water swimming better as you keep your rythmn and breathing and dont get a wee break at the end of each length.
REMEMBER a quick butterfly kick as the last kick will help you to initiate your turn as helps push your shoulders down and your legs up.
here's a link to a 3-stepguide for tumble turns.
http://beginnertriathlete.com/cms/article-detail.asp?articleid=1388
That's of course if you still need it.
Thanks Benny, that looks very helpful.
I've managed to do a few TT's now. A bit rough and ready so far but i'll keep working on it!
Good luck with it guys.
http://www.britishtriathlon.org/events/rules/competitionrules.php
Or should I say - you would be better off using the time to perfect the "pendulum turn"
Tee hee.
To add to the debate/advice... I find my most productive tumble turns are when I really slow it down and think about it: Tumble; Plant feet; Straighten back and arms; Push; Roll onto front. That video link posted earlier in the thread is a good'un for this. When I slow it down I surface about 5m from the wall.
Also, I try to take two arm strokes BEFORE I take my first breath.
As to the the should you/shouldn't you debate... I still struggle with the Oxygen deficit from tumbling, so I don't do it as often as I should. I also find it hard NOT to take a big breath when touch turning. I'm trying to tumble more and more because of this, and because I like the unbroken fluency, and because I do quite a few super-sprint events and tumbling knocks off 1s per length.
After all, we're triathletes, right? Anything that makes training MORE difficult has to be good. [:D]
Sorry but it isn;t a debate - you shouldn't because it is against the rules and if the referee sees it - it is a straight DQ
Every pool based triathlon i entered last summer had competitors doing tumble turns! The only tri that stated it wasn't legal was the warwickshire tri in straford upon avon in sept 2007!
Every pool based triathlon i entered last summer had competitors doing tumble turns! The only tri that stated it wasn't legal was the warwickshire tri in straford upon avon in sept 2007!
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It is not the organisers who allow it - and tbh they probably don't even care - It is the BTF/BTA who formulate the rules and police them (or not as you have pointed out) through the race referee.
I agree many people do waste time by hanging on the wall. 2 seconds per length is 30 secs
A better bet is still the pendulum turn - less chance of coming a cropper with a fussy referee.
http://www.tri247.com/results_2929.html
How do you do a pendulum turn? do know any links that demonstrate it?
Years back old our old club coach used to have us do endless sets and thats what he called them
Swim up to wall as hard as you can, touch with right hand and throw that hand back over your body above the water and this will rotate your body around, push off with your legs against the wall. Left hand never goes near the wall, just keep that out the way
(Obviously reverse if you are left handed)
He reckonned they were almost as fast as tumble turns
I will have a look around your tube etc and post a link if I can find one