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Newtons?? Not for heavier athletes??

Heading into town to try these at the weekend, (Newtons)

however read somewhere (220) that they are not for the heavier athlete, does anyone know what weight division this is?

I'm 6'1'' and hover around the 13 stone mark give or take. Does this put me in the heavy weights and out of contention for the newtons?

I hope not, I'm starting to buy into the hype of faster running and reduced risk of injury!

Anyone able to clarify this for me??

Thankyou all in advance


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    Phil TPhil T Posts: 49
    As a podiatrist (and an occasional injured athlete) I've done a lot of reading on Newtons and I'd approach with caution. They do work for some people I'm sure but could harm others. Reading a lot of what the top podiatrists on the planet has to say about them they seem to be for quick runners and better suited to shorter distances (i think this is mentioned in the 220 review). There wasn't much in the way of support for them.

    Also who is going to tell you that you are a forefoot or rearfoot striker? A running shop? Good luck with that. Research has shown that 6.00 min/mile or faster runners are mainly forefoot runners. Which means many world class athletes are forefoot runners hence we think if the top guys are wearing them we can wear them as it will make us faster.

    So for £130 you can keep them. Until there is much more research and research aimed at a ordinary athlete not an elite I'd steer clear. As triathletes we're obsessed by kit and gadgets and I'm wary this may be another one. Not sure that really helps with your original question but my reply is Newtons related.

    I suppose I'll sit back now and read the thousands of threads where people tell me they worked wonders for them.

    Cheers Phil
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    TrisurferTrisurfer Posts: 228
    Hi thanks for the reply,
    Its good to hear someone objective comments on the trainers, all I could find was positive reviews on the web, saying how they had changed peoples lives! (not quite)

    I went and had a look at them today anyway! felt awesome just jogging in the shop, so I bought them. Worth ago, to be injury free I hope!

    Heading out for a maiden voyage right now!!

    I'm fully expecting to be injury free from now and run constant 6min miles instead of my usual 7min miles which turn into 7.30 8.00 min miles after 3 miles!!

    cheers for the input

    many thanks!
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    Jack HughesJack Hughes Posts: 1,262
    Phil T wrote:
    Until there is much more research and research aimed at a ordinary athlete not an elite I'd steer clear.
    Interesting. This implies that there is a body of evidence for "orthodox" running shoes. When there isn't. http://bjsm.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/43/3/159?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&fulltext=Craig+Richards&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&sortspec=relevance&resourcetype=HWCIT

    There seems to be a vast gap in any serious studies done on any kind of running shoe and its relationships to injuries. We do have a vast rise in the number of injuries and surgical procedures related to those injuries. This may correlate with increased take up of sport, better diagnosis etc. Or it may not.

    There seems to be little evidence for the types of running shoes that we do have - it is accepted that the biomechanics of running are different between barefoot and when wearing an orthodox running shoe. We've had a lot of years of evolution in developing systems which server to protect us from injuries - which may, or may not be circumvented by running shoes.

    As it stands, your comment applies equally to all running shoes, as much as it does to Newtons!

    I do not own any Newtons. But am thinking of getting some - I can't really see why they should be worse than orthodox shoes, but can seem some reasons why they might be better, for a specific class of injury, if not for performance.

    Another alternative, which I do own, but have not tried for running (too injured at the moment) is the Vibram five fingers - which combine barefoot with a bit of protection for things like stones etc.
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    Phil TPhil T Posts: 49
    Just replied to this but got logged out and lost it. Couldn't be bothered to re-write it and will try again tomorrow. Yes you're correct standard running shoes lack evidence too. I did originally include that in my reply but took it out to avoid confusing people.

    However here are a couple of links which may be of interest. First one is BJSM article comparing expensive shoes to cheaper ones (remember Newtons are expensive). The second is a US forum on discussing Newton's and there are more opinions there to think about

    http://bjsm.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstrac ... 7.038844v1

    http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read. ... ad=2813112


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    BopomofoBopomofo Posts: 980
    Just as an observation: when I were a lad (at school and my first year of college) there were very few who could beat me over 100, 200, 400 and occasionally 800 metres. And I'd place pretty well at 1500 too.

    I always ran barefoot. Always. Occasionally I encountered a coach, teacher or venue who disallowed this, in which case I'd finish much lower placed and get shin splints, calf ache and other minor niggles.

    I'd stress this was only very school level stuff, nothing serious, but now I'm a lot older (well, 39 actually) I find running to be a bit of a struggle and when I think back to the way I used to run I realise I'm not at all comfortable in my gait.

    I wonder when I 'forgot' how to run barefoot? I wonder what difference that made? And now I'm wondering if it would be worth trying it again...

    I've got a new 7 mile circuit that I'm running locally. There's a few hundred metres of very slight uphill and last time I was out I realised I was running it on my toes and it felt good. Everywhere else I heel strike and over-pronate with all the other middle-aged wreckage, but on that slight uphill I felt fine.

    Maybe I'll skip the Newtons and go straight to the Five-Fingers things...
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    combatdwarfcombatdwarf Posts: 258
    Being a confirmed Newton convert and of the heavier variety (85kg+) I have to report that forefoot running is not only for those lithe people who disappear into the sunset when we finish on the bike section - we can do it too!

    Newtons tho are quite simply amazing even over half marathon distance - no calf ache and no shin splints love to see what five fingers are like...maybe if I can persuade the Chief of Staff (Home).

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    TrisurferTrisurfer Posts: 228
    good to see different opinions on the trainers.

    I've been for 2 runs in my newtons 5K and 10K.

    Finding it very difficult to maintain fore foot striking on the down hill sections of run, other than that it feels, good.
    Anyone else experience this? find myself back to my old heal striking style on the down hills.

    My calfs are burning though!
    I was told that they would though, and should stop after continued fore foot running.

    overall I'm going to stick with it, main race this year not till end of August so few more weeks to get used to new style.
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    Phil TPhil T Posts: 49
    Glad to see they are working for some people and if they do reduce injuries maybe I'll change my point of view. Who knows I may even buy some. But what I've read and researched (even after Jack returned fire) I'm not going to change my point of view. I think they are for a minority of runners who forefoot strike and the info I got with regards to sub 6 min miles is from a Dr Benno Nigg (if you're interested google him) who does a lot of research on lower limb biomechanics. He's written a great book on lower limb bio but exact title escapes me

    I had a patient in today with Achilles pain and it happened 6 months after wearing Newtons. She had no idea if she was a forefoot or rearfoot runner, she just got bought them by her boyfriend who raved about them. Its actually the one and only Newtons wearer I've ever had as a patient. I wouldn't even dream of saying told you so with one patient but I don't think her or her boyfriend knew anything about them. I do have to say though they are one of the nicest looking trainers I've seen (except Zoots I could wear them to the pub).

    Anyway, I'm off to bed and tomorrow I may do some work rather than read forums and research Newtons. But I'll finish by saying do you think you can train someone/anyone to change their running style? i.e. rearfoot to forefoot/pose method etc etc...
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    BritspinBritspin Posts: 1,655
    Interesting points.
    A few to answer from my point of view. I have Newtons I train in them I like them as they are light, but I find my feet move about in them quite a lot, in the heat last night this was uncomfortable, maybe the mesh outers have stretched too far for me, but it does inhibit my running err 'style', downhill I can maintain a mid to forefoot strike, but I think you have to 'learn' to run downhill ie take the brakes off & just goooooooooooooooooooo. The five finger things seem OK, tried some on & took a good while to put on as one invariably gets two toes stuck in the same ummm 'finger/toe' of the shoe/glove, so racing wise would be a pain in transition, I did not run any distance at all, just a quick jog & I felt like I was pounding along weighing 100kg (I am 75kg) but again I guess you get used to this & may change how you run, which brings me to my last point, I believe that yes, you can change the way you or others run, but like swim drills to correct poor form, odd habits etc it takes time & application & I am not sure we don't all revert to whatever gets us through when fatigue sets in.
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    Jack HughesJack Hughes Posts: 1,262
    Surely, we all born barefoot runners (if you get my drift), and have to learn to be heel strikers....

    I'm about to go and buy ChiRunning.. I've no idea what is in it - but I would guess that it is all about unlearning the heel striking method, and relearning forefoot striking?
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    I decided a couple of weeks ago that this winter (2009/2010) I will re-train myself to fore foot run, decision came after reading an article about the bio-mechanics of running and a lot of it made sense, well pretty much all of it did actually. If i run on the beach in barefoot, I fore foot strike and yet when I put on trainers I heel strike. In my opinion, if your body automatically reverts to one style of running when you are barefoot then that has got to be most natural way, otherwise why would you be pre-programmed to do it?

    So this winter, after my Ironman (didn't think trying to teach myself to 're-run' before a marathon was wise!) I will be attempting to follow the book Chi Running, if it is crap then I have only lost £3 so no harm done, and if it works then I will hopefully be running in the new year with a more efficient style that will benefit me in the long runs. If this happens I will go and get myself a pair of Newtons and see whether my 85kg frame appreciates them.
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